Religion and Censorship remain the Hot Topics inside the Diner in the Guerrilla Free Speech thread, the Fun with Fundies thread and the Christians Debate Christianity thread, amongst others. Below are a couple of my comments on both topics to follow up on the progress in the Guerrilla Free Speech Project.
Anyhow below you will find further thoughts on the Censorship issue in the Blogosphere, followed by a comparison of the relative merits of Jesus Christ and the Outlaw Josey Wales as Saviors for Mankind.
I think it’s funny anyone is shocked at ilargi’s claim to authority at TAE. I also think it’s funny that ilargi had to assert his authority ’cause no one was sure who was in charge. But someone has to draw the line. Even though it was badly handled IMHO. As WHD says: Let the cannibalism begin!
RE you have chosen to accept all the contrarians (cannibals) on your side of the line. Kudos to you for having the genitalia to invite them all in. I salute you. Warning: It’s really a lot like forming a club out of people who wouldn’t join a club that would have them as a member. Personally I think this is great and admirable. But how are you ever going to reach consensus? Is it going to be the opposite of the scene from Monty Pythons The Holy Grail where everyone screams “We’re all (not) individuals!!”
I doubt we will ever find solutions to all problems. However, by bringing many people together with many different POVs, you see more sides of the same Elephant. You get a better concept of the whole Elephant rather than just its Trunk or its Asshole.
You also do occassionally come up with stuff most people do agree on, like for instance it’s a wise idea to be as self sufficient as possible and not dependent on the Matrix.
I respect Surly and you attacking Group Think 100%. But calling for a higher standard of thinking while still allowing hits below the belt, is that really a higher standard? I agree that professional bloggers like yourself are far and few. Who can maintain a blog these days? To all my twitter twits: ‘Just farted. part of my self immersion in the #NewMethaneAtmosphere. Stinky, but adapt or die!’
You have to be a very dedicated writer to maintain a Blog. I’ve been at it a long time, since before Blogs were even Invented, on the Message Boards that go back to AOL days. Not always on Collapse of course, prior to 2007 and the Failure of Bear Stearns my interests were in other areas. The Collapse wiped out all other interests for me. It makes just about everything else besides your family unimportant, and of course I don’t have a family. Divorced, no kids, live alone. So I am free to spend all my free time writing about the Collapse, and if I’m not out practicing with the Guns or Fishing, that is what I do.
Anyhow, my writing has almost always been done in Dialogue with others, on Message Boards where there was ALWAYS conflict. Give people the anonymity the net offers (at least to each other if not TPTB), they’ll drop the nicities of Polite behavior faster than you can say “Religion” or “Politics” or “Sex”. So if you can’t handle the Low Blows, you just can’t have an Open Debate on the Internet. It’s NOT Robert’s Rules here.
Because I learned this fact of life over about 15 years of Internet writing, I am more comfortable than most people with the Napalm that gets pitched out all the time. You also CANhave good intelligent conversation going on while at the same time over in another Room there is a a Barfight in progress, the Diner is irrefutable evidence of that. So to me, there is no excuse whatsoever for Censoring your Board.
And yet again, as you have mentioned, it comes down to STYLE. On some level people who may have very similar outlooks end up getting into a battle over style.
Case in point, myself and Watson, Gonzo vs Academic. With the exception of the Religious stuff and the Inquisition, Watson and I agree on just about everything else economically speaking. So we occassionally got into arguments just on the basis of our disparate styles here and on TAE. They reach different audiences though, and that is all to the good. Long as the information gets disseminated out to more people this way, it is beneficial.
Apparently Karpatok is upset over grammatical errors in ilargi’s posts. Huh?! Oh yeah, and the Patriarchal Christian tendencies of TAE. Double Huh?! Judeao-Muslo-Christian tendencies is what the modern world is all about. It all goes back to that set of crazy contradictory stories collected from 2000 or so years ago. The same stories you get to pick and chose are true. Is it the part that says ‘love your neighbour as yourself’ or this one: (Moses) stood at the entrance to the camp and shouted, “All of you who are on the LORD’s side, come over here and join me.” And all the Levites came. He told them, “This is what the LORD, the God of Israel, says: Strap on your swords! Go back and forth from one end of the camp to the other, killing even your brothers, friends, and neighbors.” (Exodus 32:26-29 NLT)
Always good to have somebody well versed in Biblical contradictions Lurking on the Board.
Karpatok why so serious? Who are you smoking out? I respect your feminist anarchic tendencies but really, is smoking ash and ilargi and stoneliegh out the best you can do? Get a real target. Do you figure that taking pot shots at people on this side of the fence is the best way to show your independent thinking? Reminder to self: Can’t trust those closest to you. I understand you have rage. So does everyone else. Watch UFC. Two guys pounding the shit out of one another should assuage your rage. The patriarchy punching itself. Sounds like a win win. And as a woman aren’t you at least a bit concerned that you’re attacking a site with one of the clearest FEMALE economic voices out there: Stoneleigh? Ah, but you can’t turn it off. Attacking TAE is really just clucking for a fix.
My perception is that Xena has her own Windmills to Slay and her own Axe to Grind, which is fine. I have though recommended to her on at least one occassion so far to Put a Lid on it! This is part of my Job as Chief Mod of the Mod Squad here. Because I do command a bit of respect from Xena, she did in fact calm down her rhetoric some. Her recent stuff I haven’t found objectionable really, it’s mostly been provoked anyhow.
Far as Stoneleigh as a Female Voice haunting the halls of Testosterone here on the Internet is concerned, her presence has been EXTREMELY thin for quite some time here, predating even the Jet Setting Globe Trotting adventure she and Ilargi went on to Oz.
Stoneleigh had some very perceptive insights to offer, most notably her Tag Line of “Multiple claims to underlying Wealth” idea which pops up regularly in her stuff. She’s also quite knowledgeable in the Energy department. However, she no longer writes regularly enough to be called a “Blogger” anymore. You gotta drop on at least one decent article a week to be a real Blogger. She is more like Blogger Emeritus now, occassionally dropping back onto TAE to drop down a new Pearl of Wisdom, but it is quite rare.
Even Ilargi can’t be called a Blogger anymore. How many articles has he authored since they got back? I think I could count them on the fingers of one hand. The only True Blogger on that site now is Watson. Many people in the Commentariat of TAE noted that the Flavor changed some with the passing of the Blog Torch to Watson.
Far as Ilargi is concerned, rather than turning into Blogger Emeritus like Stoneleigh, he’s become Dean Wormer, a Blowhard who pops into the Commentary to Swing around his Tube Steak as the Big Cheese on TAE. He’s made it impossible for me to continue in the Commentariat over there, because I know he will Delete any commentary I make which criticizes him, which of course would be about all of it. LOL.
Anyhow, this is why the Diner exists at all. If it was not for the fact that I have been Banned from so many OPBs, I’d still be out in the Commentariat where I am most comfortable, writing in dialogue with others. In fact here in the Diner, I put up way more stuff every day in the Forum then I do on the Blog itself. I cannot possibly accept the idea of Censorship here, the whole reason for the Diner’s existence was because *I* have been Censored so many times before.
So instead of Censorship, I am a Manager of Napalm. I know every kind, and I am a first class Napalm Artist myself. When the Barfight breaks out here, I shuffle all the folks throwing punches into the Back Room and shut the door while they break the chairs over each other’s heads. It always calms down eventually, though you do sometimes lose some patrons because of it. Can’t help that if you want Free Speech.
But RE some of your best writing yet:
‘My goal is to get all these folks into one Bar and Duke it Out, Mano-a-Mano on the Keyboard so maybe won’t have to resort to using quite so many rounds of Live Ammo, which is going to be in exceedingly short supply down the line here. You can’t do that if you Exterminate anyone who shows up in the Bar with an opposing POV, even if that person has really bad Halitosis and has been off his Meds for few weeks and is ranting on incessantly about the dangers of 2 ply Charmin Toilet Paper.’
Yea, I thought that one was pretty good too. El Gallinazo brings out the best in me.
Speak Free on the Doomstead Diner!
God’s solution was to have his own Son, in human form, be killed on the cross for the collective sins of mankind (past, present and future), and have His righteousness transferred to every human being (past, present and future).
HTF does sending your own Son to Earth to be Crucified fix any Sinfulness? Back in those days, people got Crucified as often as J6P gets Foreclosed on today. If Jesus got Foreclosed on today, would this stop any Banksters from further Foreclosures on the rest of Humanity? I hardly think so.
Again, like delivering a set of Principles you can PREDICT people won’t follow and will just end up with a Final Battle for All the Marbles between Good & Evil, this is just a really BAD Plan and not worthy of God. A REAL God would come up with a Better Plan than having His Only Son Nailed to Cross.
A REAL GOD who wanted to solve these problems would have Armed Good People to the TEETH and told them “Go Forth ye Good J6P and SMITE the Evil Pigmen amongst you with your Glocks and AR-15s and Barrett .50 Cals!” In fact that line was in the original Dead Sea Scrolls but was excised when it was translated into Latin.
But Noooooo, instead God sends down a really skinny undernourished Namby Pamby who tells everybody to Turn the Other Cheek to Evil! WTF do you think happens then? Evil People start slapping Cheeks EVERYWHERE! Really Good Plan you got there General God!
I don’t think so. Jesus was a really Good Guy who was preaching a Message of Hope to people experiencing a first class Civilization Collapse of that Era. Sadly, this message doesn’t WORK in the real world and He PREDICTED it wouldn’t work and would just end up with a lot of suffering and a Final Battle for All the Marbles! Son of God though? Poppycock. No Son of God would be such a WIMP and come up with such a Plan DESTINED for Failure. A REAL Son of God would have arrived on Earth Packing some SERIOUS HEAT and armed J6P with enough Firepower to actually DEFEAT Satan and His Minions.
A REAL GOD would have sent the Outlaw Josey Wales to Earth, not Jesus Christ.